Kala Ellis

00:00Are you a professional looking for a job here in Nashville? Maybe you're just looking for a gig. You need maybe a better work-life balance? Change the way you work. GigPro can provide the opportunity for higher pay, a flexible schedule, and hopefully connect you with the right fit for a long-term employment. Sign up now at go.gigpro.com forward slash pro. Once you sign up and complete your profile you can earn five dollars for each person you refer to the app. Go do it now. Welcome to Nashville Restaurant Radio. The tastiest hour of talk in Music City. Now here's your host, Brandon Styll. Hello Music City! And welcome to Nashville Restaurant Radio. My name is Brandon Styll and I am your host. I think this is the last episode that you're just gonna get me until Jen Ichikawa is back. She will be back on Monday as we release our interview with Craig Barber who's the CEO of O'Charlie's and 99 restaurants.

01:15His company is called Restaurant Growth Services and that was a fantastic interview. It was a good one. I'm excited to have Jen back but today we're talking with Kayla Ellis. Kayla Ellis is the beverage director over at the Oak Steakhouse as well as Okoo over in Germantown and she's relatively new to the job. They've got a bunch of restaurants and she's gonna be working with all of them but today was a fantastic conversation. Jen always says I just love the people that we talk to. I think it's so fun you get in there in this room and we just start talking about what you do and when you get passionate people who care about what they do it's so fun. It's so fun to just dig in and really scratch the, you know, just to get beneath the surface and I feel like we did that today with Kayla. So if you have a restaurant, you're running a restaurant and you don't know what you're specifically doing with your bar program we touch on a lot of different ideas and kinda what's happening today and what you should be doing, what you shouldn't be doing with wine lists and whiskey lists and I think we cover a lot of that stuff.

02:22She was absolutely amazing and I even asked her towards the end to do something really fun and I hope that we're able to do that. We're working on it right now. So I hope you guys had a wonderful week. I don't know what this weather is we're having right now. If it's like the fourth winter or what the hell's going on but I'm ready for spring. The first day of spring was amazing and I'm ready for it. That's all I got. I don't have a lot today. It's a Friday. This episode was supposed to come out this morning and I forgot. I got busy and I forgot. So it comes out Friday afternoon and I hope that you have a marvelous weekend. Jump in right now with Kayla Ellis. We're already in the middle of a conversation when this conversation. We were talking and I said I'm going to record because I just like this conversation as we're talking. I don't want to miss any of it. So this is like mid-conversation. You jump in and then the rest of it is the interview. I hope that you enjoy it. Let's go. Rum Queen. She's amazing. She wrote a book called Tiki, which some people can't use the word Tiki. She can.

03:34What do you mean why? So it's not really right anymore. You know, if you look at like the people that started the Tiki revolution, they were two white guys and they made a lot of money off of a type of a culture. And so now you say tropical. Chopper Tiki bar. Yeah. Appropriate. I think they call themselves tropical now. Okay. But also if you actually are paying homage to like true Tiki culture and there's people who are making the people who are making money are people from a Tiki culture, like a true Tiki. Then, then you can kind of embrace it a little bit more. Oh, that makes sense. Yeah. It's, it's, you know. All right. Well, let's jump in. Okay. Kayla Ellis, welcome to Nashville restaurant radio. Thank you. You, what is exactly your title? You are with, I see that I did a little bit of stocking, not a whole lot, but a little bit of stocking. Okay. And I see a lot of posts on your Instagram, which is right there on the screen at K A D E L L I S for anybody following along at home.

04:40You're at Oku and Stakehouse. And what is your official title? What do you do for those restaurants? So I'm the company beverage director. So Indigo Road is kind of the mother company and they've got several different concepts. Each individual restaurant is actually very different from the other. So Nashville is my home base and these are the two bars that I kind of started with within the company. Oku first, and then took on Oku a couple years after that. I love Oku by the way. Thank you. I love it too. It has a fantastic spot. I just love it so much. Great mocktails. Yeah. Yeah. We make some killer, like zero proof drinks. I think that's a very important part to making good drinks is that good drinks are for everybody. So yeah. Have you, have you been to the Audrey yet? I have been through, I didn't get to spend much time, but I've heard amazing things about it. They have a machine there. Yeah. It's an extractor. I am butchering the shit out of this by the way. I don't know if it's like the technical name for this machine. I don't think it's an extractor. I like the extractor. That's what I mean. That sounds pretty sick for the purpose of this story. That's what it's called. But we were there the night and they have these zero proof drinks, but the drinks are actual, like they make, they like take rum and they have a machine that pulls the alcohol out of the rum. That's pretty dope. And then they have what's left is like the essence of the rum, but there's just no alcohol. So they call them zero proof drinks because they're made with alcohol. I guess made, I don't know if they make made with Jack Daniels.

06:16It doesn't have any of the alcohol in it. So it still retains some of that essence and the flavor. That is amazing. It is because we tried these drinks. I was like, this tastes like, like there's alcohol in it. It's like, no, there's no alcohol. We remove the alcohol from spirits. We have a machine upstairs that there's like 200 of these machines in the world. That's the only one in a restaurant. That's really unique. That's really crazy. It's out of control. Yeah. Cause I like to play with a handful of different zero proof spirits. My favorite is ritual. The ritual gin is so good. Yeah, it's amazing. And then their rum is about as close to a rum as you can get. That's not rum. But what they do is they do concentrations of flavor. And if you isolate different types of rum or gin or vodka or tequila, I guess not vodka. Vodka is intentionally meant to taste like nothing. So maybe skip the vodka, but with the rest of them, if you want to really still feel like an alcoholic, you can just drink alcohol.

07:21Just very spicy water. That's awesome. But yeah, they'll add, if you add a little bit of heat or capsaicin, you can actually imitate the burn of a spirit, which is, you know, we don't do shots before a shift. Some, some places call it family meal when you'll do a shot before a shift with your team. Instead, we do like a ginger shot because it's, you know, you still get the tinking of glasses, which is I think the most vital piece. But you, it's, there's, you get the little bit of burn. And so there's kind of like a rush, but it's healthy. And you kind of, you're like, Oh, okay. Ginger juice. Let's go. Yeah. Yeah. Just awakens you a little bit. You talk about the clinking of glasses. Do you know, like, is, I've, is this an old wives tale or is this an urban legend? I don't know what this is, but I've always heard that the cheersing, like when you cheers, that that is the fifth sense. Are you familiar with this theory? Not the fifth. No, I don't, I don't think I've heard this. Okay. So one of our core values in our restaurants is cheers.

08:23And we, we, we want to create cheers moments. I want you to have fun at work and kind of the idea behind it is when you raise a glass to somebody, it's almost impossible to do without smiling. Yeah. So when you have a drink, you can see it, you can smell it, you can touch it and you can taste it, but you can't really hear it. So when you click, it finishes the circle. And when you cheers, you can now hear it. So you're actually invoking all five senses in that moment. That makes me very happy. I like that a lot. I like that a lot. Cause yeah, I agree. Like that's, um, one of the things we always preach about cocktails is like, you know, I tell my team that if you have a garnish of some kind, um, it has to be reiterating something from the drink. I don't like unnecessary garnishes. I don't like garnishes that don't have a job to do. So yeah, they have to be aromatic. They have to, um, be visually very beautiful, but they have to also point to the drink. Um, it can be contradictory to the drink too. It doesn't have to be like, Oh yeah, there's orange in the drink. So it has to be an orange zest. It could be something different, but it has to have a job to do. Um, and so looks exactly. I can't, I mean, and, and looks are important. So it has to look good, but what is it doing other than just being, Oh, it's really cool. I really like this garnish. You know, like I'm, I'm personally kind of over the baby paperclips and baby safe, like all the different like ways to the shrub. Yeah. I mean, I, I, shrubs are good, but what is a shrub for people out there? I've heard this term. What is a shrub? It's a syrup. It's a syrup with like a, like a hint of vinegar in it. Um, so yeah, that's kind of took a left turn, but yeah, shrub is, um, I mean, there's, there's, I'm thinking like a literal, like a tiny little bunch of herbs together that you're putting on a plate. That's like a shrubbery, I guess. Like a shrubbery. Yeah. Different thing altogether. Yeah. Different thing altogether. That would be like, um, like we'll, we'll call it like a mint bundle or something like that. Um, but yeah, like I think it gets confused because like there is shrubbery. There's like, like actual trees and bushes and stuff.

10:27Um, but yeah, shrub is actually a syrup. Nice little twist. Let's, let's take another left turn. Okay. When did you, are you from Nashville? Are you a Nashvilleian? I call myself a Nashvilleian. I was born in Arizona, but I moved out here when I was probably 10 or 11. Okay, good. I moved here when I was nine. So yeah, we're there. And you've been, so you've been here since then. Yes. When did you get into like the whole spirits thing and like, what was your passion? Was there, was there a gateway for you? Yes. I, um, I am such a nerd. It's like, I mean, like such a nerd. Um, so I was a teacher, uh, for, I've been a teacher for about six years. Um, I, it was difficult. It was very, it wasn't what I thought it was going to be. Um, I was always in the service industry at the same time. Um, what did you teach? I taught K through 12th grade. Um, I started off with, with, uh, kindergarten, um, when I was in Arizona, cause I went back to Arizona for some school. Okay. Um, and then I came back into, back to Tennessee and started teaching at Frank classical school. Um, and I started helping them out here and there. Um, yeah, I just, uh, I, I was helping with music and art and, um, and then I would substitute for Spanish or literature or whatever they needed. Do you speak Spanish? Do you speak different languages?

11:47Wow. You have really good dialect too. My accent is better than my comprehension. Yeah. I'm like, wow, look at that. Yeah. But I was born in Arizona, so a lot of my friends spoke, uh, Spanish growing up. Um, but yeah, I was a teacher and, um, I was always in the industry. I, I was a grill cook. I've been, you know, all the different parts of the industry that you can work. I've tried to work all of them. And, um, at some point I was like, well, I want to bartend that. Look, I mean, I'm bored. I gotta keep going. Um, and I honestly tell people bartending saved my life. It really did. Cause, um, things didn't look like how I thought they would. I, I was really struggling with the interior, the internal dialogue that you have to be something. You have to be what you thought you were going to be. I always grew up thinking I had to be a teacher. Um, and I found that I could still teach, but I'm now teaching spirits. Um, so it's, it's all around the most satisfying job I've ever had because it's create, I get to be creative. I get to mentor different people. Um, the people in these different spheres, bartenders, they have my whole heart. Like my teams are amazing. Um, so that was kind of the switch for me. I just, I started nerding out and, you know, listening to different podcasts. Um, that kind of like, I started looking at green chartreuse, like a celebrity, like I would like see in a barn, like, oh, that's green chartreuse. I've heard of him and like, it just kept falling. I kept falling deeper down the rabbit hole. I think that's what it takes. I think that, I think that you have to have like a blend of a couple of different things, but then really what comes across is just passion. Yeah.

13:17Yeah. Uber passionate about that and you're passionate about education. Yeah, definitely. I mean, that's the, to me, you can be passionate about spirits and you yourself can learn all of these things, but then you're the only one who knows them. Like the heart of a teacher to have that level of knowledge with the heart of a teacher in your role, that's the hardest thing. So I was looking over your, your spirits, like I was looking over your cocktail menu at the Oak and I'm like, I don't know what half of this stuff is. And if I'm anybody there, like there's so much education behind that to educate people that when they're at a table or if you're a bartender explaining what some of this stuff is, they gotta know. So that's what you do. I try. So one of the quotes that always meant a lot to me growing up was that a teacher is just someone who loves what they love in front of other people. And I try to make that my habit. Like I love what I love, but I do it out loud. And the more that that spreads, it can really take on. I try to make unique menus and ingredients that, you know, maybe make people a little bit uncomfortable at first. But what I love about it is creating a menu that if you can't, if you can get this drink next door, then why are you going to stay with us to get this drink? Sure. So if I create a unique drink and a unique experience, and we have the people who have the heart and the love to translate that to the guest, then the guest is like, well, I thought this was way above my head. I thought this wasn't for me. And then they're like, no, this is for me too.

14:52Every spirit has a job to do. And even vodka. But they, if you use these tools right, and you make it so that the guest feels welcomed by these kind of austere ingredients, all of a sudden they're like, wow, this is for me too. This isn't above my head. I'm allowed in this world too. I have a restaurant in Brentwood, Mirror Bowl. Okay. One of my restaurants. Yeah. And it's a challenge, right? Because the number one thing that we sell there is like filet and mashed potatoes. Yeah. People, people know that Kendall Jackson is the number one selling Chardonnay. Yeah. Which people like, why do you still have Kendall Jackson? Like, cause everybody asks. Cause they want it. It's what they want. Yeah. It's like everybody buys it. I'm not just going to go, I feel like that's a little old. I'm not going to carry your favorite stuff now. But I also want to turn them on. There's much better stuff out there. So what I just recently did was, and I want to get into this, I'll tell you, I'm really excited about it. I made seven drinks. There's seven drinks on the menu that are the classics, right? And I used only top shelf super premium. I did like a Manhattan old fashioned, a Cosmopolitan, a Margarita, a Negroni and like a, like a Mimosa. And then those are listed on the menu that says, if you love these, we have these. You can drink these. These are great. And then I have an arrow pointing across, but if you'd like to be a little bit adventurous in the world of a Margarita, we also have this Margarita.

16:20It's a departure from the regular, but if you want to step outside the box and it doesn't, they wouldn't have known that was a Margarita if it was just on a menu by itself. They're like, that looks like a Margarita. I'm a little afraid. They don't know. Yeah. If they see that the origin was a Margarita and that if you're willing to step a little bit outside your comfort zone, exactly jump into it. And it's been amazing. That phrase that are you feeling adventurous? Yeah. That is such a key phrase. I say it with my teams all the time. Because number one, very few times does anybody, I'm not, I don't feel adventurous. Nobody's going to say that. They want to be adventurous. They're out. Yeah. Exactly. They've got to live vicariously through the people around them. And if they're only doing that, then it's time for them to embrace it when they're in the seat. So if you're sitting down in a restaurant, it's time to embrace that adventurism. But the other nice thing, sometimes I'll do this with, and it's a little manipulative, I'm not going to lie, with a, with a spirit or a wine or something that is a little more like next tier of palate development. It may be a little outside of the certain guest range. What I will do is I'll say, wow, that's a great choice. That's definitely for the more advanced drinker. And then when they get it, if they don't love, it's very rare that they don't love it because they, number one, want to be an advanced drinker. But number two, their, their brain is turning in a different way. They're, instead of the things and flavors that were scary to them because no one told them it was okay for these weird flavors to show up. But when you tell them, hey, you're adventurous or you, you're an advanced drinker now, it's like, oh, let me just think about this in another way. It's still approachable. You still want it to be approachable, but you help guide them into this. It's white, Zinfandel to a Riesling, to a Sauvignon Blanc or to a Venho Verde, to a Pinot Grigio. We're going to get to Chardonnay and we're going to move up there. I don't want to be the one drinking the pink drink, but that's what I know I like. And nobody's nudged me a little bit. No one gave me help. Yeah. And so that's, that's part of, I think

18:23that's one of the major roles of any bartender or server or anything in our industry that genuinely cares. Yeah. Yeah. I tell people, I teach cocktail classes often for like either amateurs. I do for my bartenders, of course, but we'll do it for anybody who looks for a class like that. And I tell people that when I was in college, and I think this is true for most Americans, we didn't learn how to drink. We learned how to get drunk. And that is, you know, like that's the dilemma of the prohibition. It's the aftermath of what happened when we went for 13 years demonizing spirits and not really learning in American culture how to respect this powerful entity and how to take care of yourself and how to sip and enjoy a drink. So I tell people that we're undoing the evils of the prohibition whenever we do one of those cocktail classes, because you, you got to line out the door of people who want to go talk to the bartender. And then when it's your turn to order, you're like a Jack and Coke, like a rum and Coke, like you just order with the person next to you ordered. I won't. It's easy. Yeah. I won't pretend to be above it. My drink of choice for years was a grateful dead, which is basically a Long Island iced tea with a chamboard. It's silly, but I like all out myself. I was not like a professional drinker. I didn't know what I was doing. I do. I think we have a culture of getting drunk. I think that it's especially in Nashville. I mean, that's what Nashville's known for. You come here, you get wasted downtown, you do something stupid, you get chewed up and spit out, get back on an airplane and go back to wherever you're from. And that's just what I did in Nashville. And they forget half the experience because it's all gone. It's lost in the memories. So is there, is there a lost art in taking ingredients? Because my favorite, one of my favorite interviews that I've ever done here was Josh Hobbiger. Okay. And he's a, he's a chef. Obviously he owns Bastion. But when he opened the Patterson house as the general manager, he was a bartender, mixologist. I hate

20:28that term. No, it's okay. It's safe. He was somebody who was behind the bar and he got the idea for the catbird seat while he was there. Because he was used to making ingredients, blending ingredients to create something. And then when he started doing that with a bar, he started putting that in front of people and then he would watch them. Which is something you never get to do as a chef. As a chef, you make food in the back, you put it in a window and it disappears. It's gone. You miss the experience. You don't see the end user. But he was making drinks and he would sit in front of somebody. Then he would watch what they do. Did they take a picture? Did they take the garnish outside to the side? Did they drink it immediately? Did they show their friends? Like, did they take the salt up? Like, what did they do? How are people actually drinking their product? He could tweak it every single time he saw something. Oh, I see what they're doing here and I can make it a little bit better constantly. But he was, that's not, that's not a drink to get drunk, so to speak. That is a, I'm experiencing these ingredients that somebody has put together in a very thoughtful way to create an experience for you of your senses, of your taste buds, of like trying to identify what that is. And it's, I love the movie Ratatouille. You've seen Ratatouille? There's that moment where Emil, his brother, comes to him and he's like, you have this whole kitchen. He's like, hold on. Don't, don't eat that trash. And he brings him a piece of cheese and it looks like a, like a cherry or cream. He said, now eat that. Take a bite of this. And he takes a bite. Yeah.

21:51And he's like the little music. The little sparks. Yeah. And then he goes, now, now take a bite of this and now do it together. Yeah. And it's like this symphony of symphony of sound. Like, I think that with everything, that is my favorite visual when I think about really good food or even a cocktail because that's what we're doing. We're not just making shooters for people to get drunk. Exactly. I'm trying to create an experience. How do you delineate between those two? Well, I mean, it's a challenge. I tell people you're going to get tipsy anyway. So don't make that the goal. You know, I think when it comes to drinks and you mentioned mixologist, so I'll say this real quick because a lot of people don't realize mixologist came from 1856. So it's actually like an old timey term and they were making fun of Americans because mixology was like one of the just like baseball and jazz music. It was one of the earliest things that we passed on to the whole world. And then we got hit with prohibition. So Japan actually held on to like the great art of mixology. So I don't like calling myself a mixologist, but I tell people it's a tool in my pocket to help me be a better bartender. I'm not I'm not so highfalutin that I need like you have to call me a mixologist. That is my title. No, the people like that are jerks. But when you look at the combo of mixing delicious flavors and creating experiences, a lot of times we're not connected with individual flavors. And so I will tell people, you know, focus on certain flavors. If I can give them a guided experience with like a whiskey or a rum or something like that, I can give them like a couple of notes to find. And once they get the tool set of like individually finding flavors and notes, then they're like they have the tools to find it on their own later. So I think when you when you break down, you know, the activity of drinking versus experiencing a drink, I think it comes

23:52down to isolating the community that you want to be around, making it a communal activity, because in the 1600s, it was all communal, like the definition of a cocktail didn't exist really until 1806. Some people say a little earlier than that, too. But in the 1600s, it was basically all punch. And by definition, punch is a communal drink, and then has five ingredients to it. So it was always community driven. And we just we lost a lot of that, you know, once the culture got busier, when we switched to cocktails, it was more like individual drinks made for one person, just so you could drink that and then get back to work. Because they would be drinking it either in the morning when they woke up as like a way to start your day. Or they'd be, you know, coming back from a break and getting a little sauce before they go back to work. But I think, you know, breaking down the culture of drinking it, there's a lot of mixed up stuff in there. Have you been overseas? Have you been gone over there? And the culture over there is they drink all the time. But yeah, it's different. In Italy, they drink with meals. Yeah, I drink with it's like, it's like a sauce. Yeah. You know, it's like saying I put a demi gloss on my sauce on my steak. It's like, that's red wine with food. Yeah, like that's just a part of it. It's not a let's get shit face. Exactly. It's just it's part of their culture, every day life. And I think that that being able to respect it that way, and making it less of like this, this, you know, oh, we're gonna get drunk tonight. And then it's just kind of like a thing that happens once a week or for some people more, you know, it's common in American culture. I'm not above it. I definitely have had my own like understanding of what's my balance. And for some people, the balance means nothing. And for some people, it's like, well, I can taste my cocktails. I have a bartender who's sober and he straw tastes. But that's it. And if there's any point where he's feeling it, that's like he's uncomfortable with that. And then

25:56for me, I have like this, my line is that if I'm starting to feel it, that's when I I'm like, okay, time out. And I'm not perfect. But I definitely have learned like what my boundaries are. So you got to you got to respect it. I mean, it's a it's a monster. If you don't, I have no idea what those are. Yeah. What did you say? Boundaries? What is that? I have no idea. I haven't drank in two and a half years. That's awesome, man. Because I precisely when I start feeling that is my brain doesn't go to a oh, I need to slow down. Yeah. It goes, we should go faster. We like this a lot. Yeah, I could forget about all these things that are going on if I just put the pedal to the metal. So that's the whole thing. I would love you obviously know what you're doing. And you're very, very sharp. I love the history. Yeah, like you are. You're amazing. Oh, thank you. Let's help people today. Yeah, because right now, we're talking to people all over the city who run restaurants own restaurants. What's the biggest let's let's I want to help bar managers. I want to have bartenders who work in restaurants and we don't have a beverage director and they're Hey, we're trying to put drinks together. Don't I Yeah, I don't. Yeah, it's kind of me right now. Yeah, as the beverage director. Yeah. What is what are some tips, advice, anything like the biggest mistake that people make? Biggest mistake. We're going to jump into the question and answer right after these words from our sponsors. Hey, everybody. Today we're talking about my good friend Ben Ellsworth and gig pro. After years of spending too much time and money on useless staffing software, Ben Ellsworth knew something had to change.

27:39So out of necessity, gig pro was born. Gig pro is the on demand marketplace for hospitality staffing. They're changing the way people work and hire. If you download the gig pro app today, you can get the help you need. Gig pro has an exclusive promo offer for Nashville restaurant radio listeners. Sign up at go dot gig pro dot com forward slash N R R B I Z and make sure that you use that code. I want them to know that you came from Nashville restaurant radio. That again is go dot gig pro dot com forward slash N R R B I Z. That code will get you your first gig for free up to $200. Go check them out right now. What chefs want has been serving the Nashville restaurant community for over 15 years. During that time, they've worked tirelessly to be. Well, what chefs want seven day deliveries, no fuel charges, 24 7 customer care, unparalleled availability, and they'll split almost everything they sell. If you're the kind of person that wants to see what's new when it comes in stock, you should follow them on the socials at what chefs want and sign up to be a customer at what chefs want dot com. You have heard me talk about super source for the last two years. And in that time, Jason Ellis, I feel like he's taken over the city. It is hard for me to get a guest in here that doesn't use super source. And I'm telling you, everybody loves him. When you mentioned Jason, they're like, Oh, my gosh, that guy's legitimate. Ask yourself this question. Do you feel that way about the person that provides you with your dish machine and chemicals? Because he's the real deal. And guess what? He's not gonna make you sign a five year contract. He's never gonna say, well, you signed a contract. It's on you. He goes week to week. You never sign a contract. So he earns your business every single week. I loved it when we had Cam and Nickian from the Red Perch. And they

29:42said he's like one of our employees when he's in the building. He's that good. You should call him today. If you don't feel that way about your dish machine and chemical person, 770-337-1143 is how you get a hold of Jason. Or go to NashvilleRestaurantRadio.com, click the sponsors tab. There's a special link on there that will get you special discounts for new customers. Call him now. What are some tips, advice, anything like what's the biggest mistake that people make? Biggest mistake? Um, there's there's a lot of mistakes, to be honest. And it's always survivable. I think one of the biggest things that bars do is if you can't solve a problem through training, which most places can't, they will just add another bartender to a shift. And what that means is that your bartenders have to split money that much further. It's not recognized as a training issue. It's recognized as like, man, these bartenders aren't good enough, fast enough, whatever. So we just have to put another bartender on. And sometimes that's the only solution. And so I won't I won't knock it if that's, that's the only place way that this place can survive. But if you have the ability to work on mise en place with bartenders, I think, you know, tied to that mistake is the fact that mise en place will change per bartender, that should go away. Um, you know, if you have a small bar that can be run with one bartender, sure, then you can have it to where the bartender can rotate their mise en place.

31:18Let's let everybody in a mise en place literally translates to everything in its place. Right. So it's every little bit of garnish, everything that you need, tinctures, all of the things that you would need. It's preparing for anything that could possibly happen. And it's all of your stuff you've got right there ready to make all of the drinks for the night in advance. And the chefs have it in the kitchen. Absolutely. Bartenders absolutely the same way. And people may do it differently. Yeah, but having being ready, so you have to you have to have it helps with muscle memory. Yeah. So so if you every time I reach out for a bottle, it should be the same exact bottle that I'm touching. Every time I am reaching for a garnish, it should be the same area for that same garnish. Um, if you have it to where there's multiple people working behind a bar and other one bartender sets his well up this way and another one sets hers up that way. Um, it can kind of, um, change how people Oh, you're great. Um, it can kind of change how people train their muscles. Um, and you need that muscle memory to have a fast shift. Um, and, you know, I see a lot of people, uh, their ticket times increase. Um, all around Nashville, we're seeing better bartenders come around and we're developing a very strong bar culture. Um, I mean, you listed Bastion. Some of my favorite bartenders in the world are right here in Nashville. Um, I think that if you have that set mise en place, if you have it the same, exactly the same, everybody can learn it. It only takes honestly about two to three shifts for your muscles to start remembering where this certain bottle was. Um, but a lot of people will just let the bartenders go one for one. Everybody picks their own. They can decide it together. I tell the bartenders all the time, this is where I'm starting you off. And if there's anything that doesn't work for you, let's decide together how we should switch it. Um, and that way they do have ownership over it. Um, the last thing I would say as far as, you know, tips for, for bartenders specifically and for bar

33:21programs, um, I'm, I work on intentionality, which creates humility. Um, I don't think we have time anymore for the ego star tender. You know, I just, I don't have time for it. Um, you know, it's just gross. It's gross. All of these star tenders out there that are like, I made the best drink in the entire world. I bet you did. There's, there's so many great drinks in the world. You know, I do think you should pat yourself on the back if you made something really cool, but get over yourself. You didn't invent the old fashion. Um, that's the best cocktail that will ever exist. So, you know, it just, I think that, uh, if you can practice intentionality with your team, care about little things like cutting your tape rather than tearing it when you're labeling things. Uh, if you do those little practices of intentionality, then when the cocktails come out, there's a sense of care. Um, so I'm very like, I wouldn't say strict because I mean, I have the voice of a little girl. So, um, if I'm going to say something, it sounds like no matter how angry I am, I'm like, well, so we need to try things this way. And, um, you know, as strict as I am, they take it to heart. And then I put their name on a menu.

34:34I always put the bartender's name. I'm now it's a rule of thumb at all of my bars that I have a say in. I put their name next to their drink. And so it's a form of, yeah, it's, it's a way, it's a way to say like, first let's humble ourselves to know that we all have room to grow. I have, I have so much more growth that I hope to reach. Um, and I, I were never going to be done training, um, and so if they can have the humility to accept that, then they can have that moment of pride in what they created because they are not a reflection of their work. Their work is a reflection of them. And that's, I think how you break down the ego. Um, so those are, those are the top things I would say for, for bars. Wow. Okay. So that was a lot. I know, I know, but it's technically three things. That was fantastic. That's exactly what I wanted to know. And I think that was more towards bartenders, which is good. Um, which I think this might translate as well to like bar managers. What I heard you just now say is being intentional. And I think intentionality is something that gets taken for granted sometimes because that's the way we've always done it. And why, why is that the way you've always done it? Because that's the way it's done. And that's never like for me, if I ever hear somebody say, that's the way we've always done it. I immediately like, I turn into a Sherlock Holmes, like, well, I'm launching an investigation to find out why and why we do that that way. If it's, if it's right or wrong, I now want to know why it began that way. Cause now somebody, somebody we've always done it that way.

36:09And I think I might have a better way to do it, but I want to know the reasoning behind it. And I'm insane with that because I think that you have to be intentional with every single thing that you do. And that starts with the parking lot to your front door, like every single aspect of service. And I love the word, I've really got big on this word, frictionless, to be intentional, to create a frictionless experience because people coming into bar that don't know something, they need something, they need a bartender with the heart of a teacher, especially when you're making cocktails that are just developed, to be intentional with them and say, let me tell you why we're doing this. Let me tell you the story behind it. And they go, wow. And that is what fills in those little spots of the story. That's what fills in the experience is you being intentional with all of that stuff. And I think that that's from the moment you get there as a bartender, where everything goes, making sure you have backups, making sure that everything is ready, but you're being intentional.

37:12You're not just being reactive because you can be reactive at seven o'clock. Exactly. When you run out of paper towels and you're like, yeah, why didn't I do that at five when I had time? I mean, there's just so much with you prep for what, no matter how busy your night is looking like it's going to be, prep as if it's going to be the busiest you've ever been. And the bartenders are at the point, because we do a lot of batching with our programs. And I know that's a big no-no with mixologist. I think it's silly for it to be a no-no because I understand the mentality of it because sometimes people are batching without understanding how the flavors are going to rest together. Sometimes they're putting bitters in their batch. I suggest not doing that unless you know that that batch is going to be blown through in a day, but bitters will bloom. So there's lots of little things like if you are going to batch, you have to do it right. But people argue that that's not right because you're you're not building the individual drink for the guest. But for the 1600s and 1700s, it was mostly punch. It was all batched. So the flavors were resting together. So yeah, if you're intentional about it, batching is a great thing to do for a program and increases your speed. But that's the kind of prep you should, those are the kind of steps you can take to be high craft but still high volume. So if I'm a bar manager and I want to, I want to run the best bar, I've stopped in both of my restaurants. I've taken away the bar manager title. Okay.

38:41I'll tell you why. Because the second that you bring somebody in that isn't, if I hired you, I'd be intentional. I would want you to be running the bar. But if I hire a restaurant manager to come in, if I promote a server or whatever that comes in and they go, I want to be the bar manager. I immediately go, no, no, no. No, you're gonna be a manager in the restaurant, but I'm gonna hold you accountable for doing the bar inventory and bar ordering. I feel like the first second you give somebody a bar, they go, oh, we need to change the house wines and I want all the reps to come in. They're gonna bring, I want samples and I need this, I need that. And it's like, slow your roll, just calm down. See, this is the inverse of like, one, you don't want to do things the way they've always been done just because they've always been done that way. However, you can't reinvent the wheel either. There's no reason to go back and reinvent the wheel. If something's working, then it's working. Yeah, and that's it. Like the Kindle Jackson thing. You know, it's a thing. It's a thing. I've found that it's successful when you bring people in because the first thing that a manager, a bar manager does is they hang out at the bar. Yeah. This is my, like, there's 200 other seats in the building that I need you to focus on. You have to think about all of them, yeah.

39:51Not just the seven seats at this tiny bar. Yeah. We need to order this stuff. We have the majority, 90% of the stuff's being sold outside of here. And so if I'm a new bar manager, I'm coming in, what are some things that might help me? Well, I'm asking you because I'm looking, I have a bar manager. You're great. This is me wondering. No, no, no, this is great. I usually, because I'm in the role that I am, I will often make someone a lead bartender or head bartender rather than bar manager. And a lot of people don't even know that there's a difference. You know, a bar manager to me is someone who eventually doesn't take tips. You know, they might if it's broken down in the right kind of way or if they're not salary and whatever it is. But if you have a head bartender, they're someone who to me is kind of the cooler job. I remember when I read Death and Co. the first time, the first round of when they came out with that, they described the head bartender and I was like, I never want to be a bar manager. I just want to be the head bartender.

40:56So I mean, I would consider for for those who are in your role of trying to break that down, maybe just get a head bartender and then they can break it down the way that they need to. And there's like a list of things that I would expect from a head bartender. I would expect them to yes be on inventory, possibly helping with orders. I wouldn't expect them necessarily to be doing the schedule. No, I would I would expect them to help me with keeping up the standard. And, you know, if I'm doing tastings or menu creation, I would want them to feel comfortable giving guidance to the more green bartenders. But they would kind of that would be it like they would help with restocking and all that kind of stuff. To a bar manager or lead bartender, I would say come out the gates with empathy. Both accountability and empathy together will make you clearly set apart from other leaders because you are in the trenches with the other bartenders. If you come in with that star tender attitude of like now I'm in this role, look at me. You are screwing yourself over. You're shooting yourself in the foot.

42:03Do you see that? I mean, I feel like all the time. Really? It's exhausting. I mean, the the the teams that I'm lucky enough to work with now are just phenomenal. Oh, my gosh, I'm so blessed. My bartenders are dope. They are the most like I get so teary sometimes because like I just love them. They're they're they're so caring. They have all elevated their their game. They have all I've set different standards and they've like looked for how they could meet those standards and then some they deal with the same challenges as every other bartender. But they've definitely continued to up their game. But we've absolutely had to get people out of the way that we're creating toxicity within the program. You know, there's there's how would one do that? Create toxicity among the oh, you know, acting hurt every time that someone tries to hold you accountable. Every time not being coachable. Yeah, like just just being so and I don't like I think sensitivity is a good thing. So I don't want to knock sensitivity. But there's a difference between having a fair response and a very intuitive response to the world around you that is sensitive that is tight, like really locked in. And there's a difference with so that's one thing.

43:20But then there's people who are sensitive to the point where they're reading into other people's responses and are incapable of seeing their own flaws. So I'm going to going to tell you what I do for that. I would love to hear. I have a book that is really short. It's about an hour long to read it. It's like 100 pages, big words. It's called QBQ. Okay, the question behind the question. And it teaches you how to stop victim based thinking. Right? So when you the description, what you just now said was they're constantly trying to figure out what you meant behind that. How are you doing this to me? You're doing something to me and they're so caught up in their own mind trying to figure out how they're going to respond to you doing this to them, that there's no listening whatsoever. They're not going, yeah, maybe I did that. But there's questions that we ask ourselves every day, right? That makes us feel that way. How come they did this? How come they never set me up for success? How come they never stock the bar at night time?

44:28How come I always get the shitty shifts? But you don't say those out loud, but you say those to yourself and immediately you say, how come they didn't set me up? I'm a victim. This happened to me. You just internalize this like brokenness between you and this other person. It's just completely like now they are other and you are in your own pain. It's like they're the enemy. We live by this book and it's a, you teach yourself to insert yourself into the question and you ask yourself, right? So if that happened to me, I came into work and nothing was stocked and it wasn't, I was not set up for success, which I typically would be coming in at nighttime, all the fruits cut or whatever. Instead of saying, how come they did this to me? And then feeling like a victim said, what can I do? Say what, what or how, what can I do to ensure this happens next time? And you go, what can I do to ensure that fruit is cut next time? What can I do to ensure the wine is? And you go, well, I can talk to a manager. I can find out who did this last night and I can have a conversation with them. But you start coming up with solutions and you don't feel like this happened to me. Put yourself into the solution. But it's amazing because my whole leadership team now focuses on that. Like every time I hear them say all the time, what do you think the QBQ of that question you just asked me was? What do you think the question behind the question is? And they go, what could I do to ensure that my food gets ran? There you go. Versus how come they never run my food? Well, what can I do to ensure that this is equitable for everybody?

46:06It's just a way to train your brain to stop being a victim and be personally accountable. That's the problem right now. It's the one issue that I find is that people aren't personally accountable. They want to blame everybody else for anything that's happening to them versus looking in the mirror and saying, what can I do to be a better teammate? What can I do to be a better employee, a better bartender? And then actively go seek those things out and make it happen. I think what I like about that the most is that, so I'll be honest, as a female bartender, as a woman in an industry that for a long time I only worked with guys, I would have issues and I could have brought it to a manager and nothing would have happened. In fact, did bring it to managers and nothing would happen. I was in a managerial role. I was the lead of the bar and I had a bartender say, I don't respect you because you're a woman flat out. And it was like, oh, it's just the funniest, cutest little thing. And everybody kind of went on. So I like what you're saying because it doesn't delete accountability. It doesn't create gaslighting. It's not saying, hey, this isn't a problem and you shouldn't be upset. It's, hey, how do I fix the problem? Period. Simple. It's not blaming somebody for the problem.

47:24Put yourself into the solution. What can I do to ensure that you understand how upset I am about this issue? I'm going to sit you down. I was just walking away from that, sitting going, you know what? What can I do? Sometimes it means I'm not going to work there for those people. That's the tough thing. Sometimes that's what it is. Sometimes it's these people aren't the people, they're not my people and they don't respect me. I had this conversation today. Somebody said, I'm reading a book right now called how to talk so your kids will listen, how to listen so your kids will talk. Okay. Right. I have six and eight year old children. I love it. And so many times I say the kid will walk in the room. I think I mentioned this in another podcast a couple weeks ago, but kid will walk in the room and he'll go, I'm not hungry or I'm, I don't feel good or I'm tired. You're not tired. Come on, let's go. Hey, I need you to get, we're going out to eat. I'm not hungry. Like you just want to play your game. You're hungry. Look, come on. Or whatever they tell you. You're constantly telling people how they feel. And there was a situation recently where somebody said, I came into work and the guy didn't respond to my email, but he did the things and I came in and I said, why didn't you do this? And he says, I did it. He says, why didn't you respond to me? And he goes, I didn't think I needed to. And he's like, then he, then this person, a came back at him. Like you need to do that. And he goes, man, I feel like you don't respect me. And he goes, no, I do respect you, but you need it. And it's like this railroading of, it's like, no, no, no. You can't tell him that you don't feel this. He just told you, I feel disrespected. You have to stop and go, wow, validate that feeling for a second and say, I am so sorry that you feel that way. Can we go talk about it? Can we go sit down and identify why you feel? Cause that wasn't my intention. My intention isn't to make you feel that way, but I validate that you do feel that way. So let's go have that conversation and just to sit down and say, tell me you'll learn so much from validating people's feelings. Cause a lot of times they're true. Like in the situation you're saying, Hey, look, you don't respect me. Yes,

49:25you do go away. It's like, well, maybe if people do that all the time, maybe they're not the right people to work for until you find somebody that actually does respect you. Cause there's a lot of, there's a lot of restaurants out there. There's a lot of people out there who are doing it right. And there's a handful, maybe more than a handful of people that aren't. And I think it's conversations like this that open up a dialogue between, Hey, we need to do this the right way and not do it the wrong way. And some people don't even know. Some people are completely blind to the fact that, Oh, I do that all the time. It's a self-awareness thing. It's like, I mean, this is the best company I've ever worked for. And I don't say that lightly. I have really had a hard time in a handful of different companies. I already mentioned like dealing with direct sexism and just like abusive behavior, people definitely getting like half the amount that a guy would have gotten in for me doing the same role. And it's hard. It's really hard to not have that almost like PTSD of being burned by the industry. I don't think my restaurants are perfect by any means. I don't think anyone could ever say that because you've got a human element. So that's never going to happen. But I think it's the least troublesome environment that I've ever been in. I've never felt respected in the industry. And as this is my first go of being a beverage director, I'm like, man, it feels good. It just feels nice to be like, okay, we see you. We see that you have knowledge.

50:59We see that, you know, for a long time, I was, I was afraid I would get pinned as a quote unquote mixologist, or I would get pinned as like someone who's creative, but can't do the financials. And then I proved like, no, I can do numbers. And then when I did numbers, it was like, Oh, but can you, can you get a team to respect you? And will they listen to your guidance? And I was like, no, I can, I can do that too. Because mentorship is actually the heart of what I love about the industry. And so after I was able to collect these like different things and different echelons of my skill sets, I finally had a company that saw it and was like, you know what, I want you to do this more. I want you doing just this, but in a bigger platform. So how does that feel when that, when, when that happened? Like what, of all you've been through and I, I, I feel what you've been through. You go through all of that. How does that feel when somebody says, we value you for you? I wish Jen was here today. She would, she just called him like, damn, I wish Jen was here. I have a cohost, Jen. She's amazing. And she would love talking to you.

52:03Yeah, I'll have to catch up with her then. Definitely. We'll have to do that again. But how did that feel when that moment happened for you? I am still processing it to be honest. This was like a lifetime goal. And I mean, I get, I think I've like, I don't know if I've actually cried yet about it. I think I have. But I like got on the phone with like different friends, call people and like, this is, this is happening. This is something, you know, I, I felt frustrated that to not be a teacher the way I thought I was going to be, I felt frustrated that people that I had those harder times with different bartenders or different people in the community that were like, no, you're a woman. You know, we're not going to pay you what you deserve. We're not going to respect you. And to look back, I mean, it's kind of funny, I was, I texted my friend, Brandon, who was my head bartender at Oak Steakhouse. He said, he was like talking to me about different bartenders that had challenged me in not good ways. And we were talking about it. And all of a sudden I started cracking up because I was like, wait, did I just become the beverage director of a company with over 32 bars just to prove him wrong? Like, did I really just spend eight years working towards this goal to say, F you? And I kind of think I might have.

53:24I guess whatever motivates you, right? I mean, it was kind of funny, but it's just, it's so empowering. It's wild. There's about 32 bars and growing. And I'm right now only intimately close with about four or five of them, I would say. And then I'm still like making connections with different bartenders. But we just had a conference and every person was like, when can you come to our bar? When can you come by? I mean, it's just such a joy to be like, I don't have to defend my knowledge. I don't have to defend my dorkiness instead. They're like, oh, she's not just a mixologist. She can actually get our numbers right. So I don't know. It's just, it's, it's going to take a while to process, but it feels good. It feels really good. Well, I couldn't be more excited for anybody. Like that's fantastic. And I'm glad that you're in the role that you're doing. I'm glad you're at the place. I'm glad that they treat you that way. I have this dream that one day this industry will be fixed. Yeah. You know, I was really inspired at Audrey the other day because I went upstairs and they have an R and D room. Do you know anything about this? Have you seen, have you been in there?

54:33I haven't been in there, but yeah, I've heard about this. They have an R and D room up top and they have all these machines in there and they're doing some of the craziest things I've ever seen with food, but they have a room in the back. They have a wellness room. Okay. So they have a library. First of all, there's a library in there with all these books and you can go in and like spend time in the library. And there was a chef in there reading and studying while we were there, but then they have a wellness room. Okay. And it's this room at the end of this hallway and it's carpeted and there's a massage chair in there and there's yoga mats. And then there's like headphones and it's just a room that if you need to take five, 10 minutes, like if you're, it's like a well, like if you're in the middle of a shift and you have something issue or you just need a quiet, safe place, there's like this room that you can go use at the restaurant. That's amazing. Usually it's the walk-in freezer. So that's a step up for sure. But this is, but you talk about being intentional. Being intentional with that of having a really good non-alcoholic program for people like me that want to feel normal when I go out, I can drink one or two of those. And then like to have a room that people can go in and just like meditate. Like I need five minutes and we go upstairs. Like I think that's beautiful.

55:41I think it's, in fact, I would say it's precious. I think that's precious because, so when quarantine happened and we all got let go, it was like so many different feelings. I just was so protective of my teams. So I'm not good at taking care of myself. That's like kind of a known thing about me. But I wanted to know more about how to get unemployment, all that kind of stuff, because I knew the teams would have questions. So it forced me to take care of myself. And so there was a time with quarantine that I was like, you know what, I haven't ever not worked, you know, since I was probably, I think I was like 16 or 17 when I first got a job, and I've never not worked since. And the hours are pretty grueling. I mean, when I first, the first time that I ran two bars at once, I was working 100 hour weeks easily, like clocking in 100 hours a week, sleeping in my car and going into the next place.

56:41That has to stop. I mean, yes, like it's just it was, again, a sign of a restaurant ownership that wasn't aware of how to help your team have boundaries or to take care of themselves. Because that was if I didn't work 100 hours a week, that place wouldn't have opened. And so it was kind of just like a necessary, but it's not necessary. No one should, it should never be necessary to half kill yourself. So I wonder why there's alcoholism and mental health, right? You feel when you feel that type of need to be somewhere that much like, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no. It's food and drink. That's not okay. It's just food and drink. Why are we, why are we knocking ourselves out for just food and drink? You know, make sure people have a good time. But, but yeah, so it was rough. There's a culture, I think, of not enough. Yeah. There's a culture of I'm not enough. And especially now with social media, with seeing the highlight reel of everybody's life all the time on social media. And it's like, it's an impossible standard to make up.

57:42And you see these celebrity chefs, you go, I want to get there. And it's just, it's just hard work. If I work 100 hours a week, I'm the one who does, it's like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Work 40 hours a week, but work 20 hours a week on books and studying yourself, like go hiking, do things that are good for you. Ideate, like use your brain to think about other things, work smarter, not harder, you know, and it's, it's a culture in this industry of, I got to be there from open to close every day. Yeah. And it's wrong. It's just plain wrong. And I think we're coming to that realization. Like the idea of like working while you're sick, all of those kinds of things, that's a cultural problem. And obviously we're breaking, it was broken a decent bit because you can't work with COVID. You just need to go home. Yeah. It's still a challenge though, because you do still have to tell people like, hey, like, I know you don't like just take care of yourself. You got to take care of yourself. I don't know if, if this is too cheesy or not. Nothing's too cheesy.

58:42Okay. Well, it's tied to his, it's tied to, it'll come back around to history, I promise. But I had a mentor when I was like maybe 15 or 16, who she had said, and it's never gone away from my mind, this idea that the things that you keep hidden are the things that grow. And the things that you show for the world to see, that's what gets diminished. So yes, with social media, like what you show for the world, that's what's going to be diminished about your character. You want everyone to think that you're happy, go lucky and happy and fine. That's going to get diminished because that's what you're showing for the world. It's when we bury all of the ugly stuff in ourselves and we don't want anyone to see it, that those things are actually the things that are festering and growing. It's like a room full of cockroaches. If you flip on the light, they're going to dissipate and run away, but they stay in the dark. Lack of true vulnerability. And no accountability. And so that concept had always stuck with me. And when you look at what happened with Prohibition, all of the drinking culture. By 1915, half the states went dry.

59:51By 1920, we actually get the Volstead Act and now it's illegal to sell alcohol. But it didn't stop. Bars didn't stop. They just went underground. Speakeasies. Speakeasies. And they were run by mobsters and basically teenagers. And all of the art of the bar had to go away because that was their living. It was the same. You studied to be a bartender like you would study to be a doctor. It was a craft. And so they couldn't just stop. They had studied that for years. So they moved to Europe and elsewhere to be able to continue their livelihood. But I think it was something like 180,000 saloons closed down. Those are big numbers in our time, let alone in the 1900s. So when you look at the culture having turned inward towards the worst parts of drinking, it kind of makes sense that we have what we have today with 13 years of that culture. 13 years of drinks being hidden and the worst part of drinking being the norm.

01:00:53And so I think back to that. The shame around it. Yeah. And you're reinforcing and justifying other people's shame. Reinforcing and justifying their drinking culture, which is still very much happening in restaurants today. We justify very unhealthy activities with one another. We make it okay to drink yourself silly or for people to engage in drugs and different things because that's what everybody else is doing. So it should be okay. Well, that's their solution. It's their coping technique. I was joking. I said I didn't have an alcohol problem. Alcohol was fine. That was my solution. I had other problems. Alcohol was my solution. This is how you got through those problems. Yeah. But when you work that much and there's this culture of I'm not enough. So you try so hard to be enough, but you don't get there. I think part of some of when you got your job, that's kind of that you're enough. We care. We want you. You are enough. You're there.

01:01:57That's a ton of weight on your shoulders to go, holy shit, somebody sees me for who I am. Nobody's telling me that I'm not good enough for that, which I think builds a confidence in the way that you felt like as leaders in this industry. How do we make other people, how do we take that weight off their shoulders too and go, you've got nothing to prove. You got it, man. You're doing it. You're there. You're enough. You're good. I think we need to focus more on that versus a, oh, you have the sniffles. You better come to work. Yeah. That's garbage. I think it's garbage to fake that stuff and to say, oh, I'd rather go out partying tonight. I'm going to call out of work or not come in. There is a level of accountability there, but I think there's also, like you said, empathy of, hey, look, that's tough, and right now with COVID and everything else, it's been a real challenge. Six and one and a half does the other. Which side do you go and finding balance in all of that's really hard. It's challenging, super, super challenging. But I think if we ask ourselves, the question I like to ask myself is, what can I do to make this industry better? What can I do to help further a conversation about healthy boundaries?

01:03:09Yeah. That's literally what I want to try and do. I thank you today for jumping in with me. Bartenders are my whole heart. I love them so much. I think they don't get the recognition they deserve. I think every corner of the restaurant industry is precious to me. I was a grill cook for a long time. I did see how hard chefs are working and honestly, dish pit is the hardest job in the whole restaurant. I know that I don't have the sphere of influence in those other parts of the restaurant, but I do with bartenders. I don't know. I just think that it's a huge opportunity to get to work with the people I get to work with. But yeah, it's an honor every day. You just got to take it like that every day. I hate saying this stuff on the air because don't feel any kind of like- No, you're good. I think it would be fun to do a spinoff of this podcast. Maybe just like a short series, like a Nashville restaurant radio presents. Kayla talks to bartenders.

01:04:13Oh, I love it. I would love to get you having conversations with bartenders and just open the dialogue from what, because you're going to talk. You know what they're doing. I think get somebody from Atta Boy and Fox and Oak or Oak Hoo, whatever it is. But do like, it would be fun to like six different interviews and put it out as a special series, like the bar series. And I think education from just understanding a perspective of somebody else in their shoes is amazing. And I don't know enough about the bar culture to really mean I'm an old guy and I don't go out drinking and I don't know what's happening out there. I think that'll be so much fun. Would you want to do something like that? I would love to. That sounds awesome. Okay. Like I said, I'll put you on the spot here. Be like, no, I don't think so, man. No, that sounds awful. No, I think it sounds great. I would love to do something like that. It'd be awesome. Let's figure that out because I think that would be pretty badass just to have, just like a spinoff, like, hey, we're going to do some bonus episodes here.

01:05:16I love that. Let's roll. I like that your mind went there because honestly that would be super fun. I love that. Okay. I love sharing conversations and sharing perspectives and I love yours. I love you. You're amazing. Jen always tells me I fall in love with every guest that comes in because I just love people that have passion for something. I love that you're doing stuff that is the right way and you're helping change this industry for the better. And I love, I just love that. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for that. Yeah, no, thank you. We're at the, we're at the end. So what I do on every episode is I ask our guests to take us out. Okay. So whatever you want to say, you can summarize this interview or you can say whatever, whatever comes to mind, whatever, if you're talking to the people in the national restaurant world, whatever you want to say, as long as you want to say it, floor is yours. Okay. I would say love each other well and do so through accountability and empathy.

01:06:23And it's been a great opportunity to come on here. So thank you, Brandon. It's my absolute pleasure. Thank you. Kayla Ellis. Is that right? That's right. Kayla Ellis, follow her at it's K D Ellis K A D E L L I S on Instagram. Do you have anywhere else? Oak steakhouse. If you want to go check out her drinks, go to the Oak steakhouse. It's in the bottom, like out of the Westin hotel. Yep. And then you got to go check out Oak Coo. The, the food is out of control. It's so good. I imagine the drinks good. I had really good zero proof drinks there, but a great vibe and just so, so fun. It's over in Germantown. It is. Yeah. Right across the street from the optimist. So if you're familiar with that area, look them up. It's O dash K U and the Oak steakhouse. Kayla Ellis. Thanks again. Thank you so much, Brandon. Oh my goodness. Kayla Ellis, you were amazing. And we are actively working on having her come in to do some shows for us. Wait until the very end of the show. We've got a lot of really cool stuff coming up with Nashville restaurant radio and new light hospitality solutions.

01:07:39So you're going to start seeing us ramp up new light hospitality. So go, go find us on Facebook, the new light hospitality solutions page and hit like, like it, and we're going to start putting up stuff weekly, interesting, cool things, we're going to get into it more in the next few episodes, but we've got some cool stuff coming for the hospitality industry here in Nashville. So, uh, yeah. So we're going to have an Instagram page. We're going to start making real soon for new light. And, um, thank you guys for listening. This is amazing. Go like I said, Nashville restaurant radio, go like me at Brandon underscore N R R and Jenny Chikawa is Jenny Chikawa underscore N R R if you want to follow her. So again, thanks for listening. Have a wonderful, wonderful weekend. Please be safe out there. I love you guys. Bye.